- Union City Planning Commission
and Board of Zoning Appeals Meeting Minutes
- Third Quarter 2002
9, 2002, Meeting Minutes
24, 2002, Meeting Minutes
13, 2002, Meeting Minutes
10, 2002, Meeting Minutes
July 9, 2002
Commission meeting was called to order and attendance was taken.
All the commission members were present.
1. Mr. Shields
asked if there were any additions or corrections of the minutes
of the April 9, 2002 meeting. There were none so Mr. Beyer moved
that the minutes be approved. Mayor Packard seconded the motion.
Mr. Shields abstained, the other commission members voted for
the motion and the minutes were accepted as prepared.
2. Mr. Shields then asked if there were any additions or corrections
of the minutes of the June 11, 2002 meeting. There were no corrections
to be made so Mr. Beyer moved that the minutes be approved. Mayor
Packard seconded the motion. Mrs. Thomas-Roth abstained, the
other commission members voted for the motion and the minutes
were accepted as prepared.
3. 02-12 -
Final Plat application for Concord Meadows, Section 3.
introduced Jeff Van Atta from Van Atta Engineering. Mr. Van Atta
was present to represent Mr. Sam Knobler who is currently out
of the country.
said this was the final application for Concord Meadows, Section
3. Sections 1 and 2 are currently being developed and lots are
still being sold. Section 3 would be the next group of single
family homes and it complies with the conceptual plan that was
approved by the planning commission. Woolpert Engineering is
currently reviewing the plan. Mr. Applegate said the approval
of this application would be contingent upon the final results
of the engineer's review.
Mr. Van Atta said he felt they were in compliance with Union
regulations and would make any modifications as required.
Mr. Applegate said HLS Engineering which did the first few sections
is no longer doing the work for Concord Meadows. Van Atta is
the new engineering firm.
Mr. Beyer asked when they would be ready to start. Mr. Van Atta
said as soon as they would receive the approval of the construction
drawings, they would be ready to start. Mr. Applegate said Mr.
Knobler would like to start in early August.
Mr. Marsh asked how many more sections were proposed. Mr. Van
Atta said there are roughly three more single family home sections
and three more two family home sections.
said the development was looking very good.
Mr. Shields asked if the lots were large enough to avoid needing
variances. Mr. Applegate said they were except that some homes
were larger, like seventeen and eighteen hundred feet. The next
sections of lots will be smaller, more like the R-PUD size. The
developer was asked to make the lots larger in the first sections
to blend better with the existing homes.
Mr. Applegate said he wanted to point out that the back lots
are what is generally more like R-PUD lots.
Minimum width is sixty-four and seventy-four feet. Lots can be
larger but not smaller.
Mr. Applegate said that only nine homes out of the twenty-two
built in Concord Meadows are less than sixteen hundred square
Mr. Applegate said that he had informed MidLife Development on
the discussion of the square footage increase. They are very
much opposed and ask that the city hold a special meeting so
they can discuss this further.
If this section is approved, it will be subject to current regulations.
Mayor Packard moved that Concord Meadows, section 3 be approved
pending the review by Woolpert Engineering. Mr. Shields seconded
the motion. All concurred and the motion was passed.
4. 02-13 -
Review of new proposed conceptual preliminary plan for Mill Ridge
president of the Brethren Retirement Community, Barbara Kreuzer,
house manager and Dale Musser,
director of construction, in charge of the landscaping was present.
They have a new site plan worked up by the Troyer Group. The
original design had a large area of green space. They decided
to make more room to add different levels of care.
The first phase, repeated five more times and would have had
about seventy two units. It has been redesigned to include 125
independent living units. Most are single dwelling units and
approximately thirty of them would be duplexes. They have changed
the campus to be more attractive. They are adding water areas,
an actual mill, a mini-golf course, a playground, and a pavilion.
The existing community building would have a walkway connected
with assisted living and independent congregate living so as
people's circumstances change and they need more services, they
could move to more care but still stay within the facility.
They would hope to provide food and dining services for the community
or possibly the surrounding area.
Most of the duplexes would be near the community center because
that is where the hub of the services would originate. The buildings
would probably be two floors, possibly three. They would have
phases one through eight, with each phase taking twelve to eighteen
months. The service area would be in phase six, so they would
have a better idea of where the market is.
Mrs. Thomas-Roth expressed concern about the ponds being on the
outside of the development which was discussed on the original
plan. Mr. Puckett said because of the stone being so close to
the ground, the ponds would not be more than two to three feet
Mayor Packard expressed concern that it was a multi-family and
that was not included in the zoning.
Mr. Marsh asked
what size the units would be. Mr. Puckett said between thirteen
to eighteen hundred square feet.
Mr. Puckett said he would like to see if they could build 900
square feet units closer to the service area. Mr. Puckett said
retirement communities have units as small as 600 square feet
sometimes. Eight hundred square feet is very common with a single
car garage. Often people can only afford a smaller unit, thirty
percent of those people moving in will lose a spouse within five
years. He proposed that not more than thirty percent of the units
would be less than 1,100 square feet, greater than 900 but less
Mayor Packard asked what the cost would be on a single unit.
Mr. Puckett said it would be $80.00 a square foot, so a 1,500
square feet unit would be $120,000. The monthly fee is between
$495.00 and $545.00 which is the maintenance of the grounds and
the units themselves. They will have a housing manager.
There is an area for maintenance and RV parking. Mr. Puckett
said that area would be enclosed.
Mr. Applegate asked if one of the exits would come out on Heckman.
Mr. Marsh asked if two major entrances coming out on the same
road would be a safety concern with the police and emergency
vehicles. Mr. Applegate said the station was close to the area.
Other households have limited exits and entrances. Mr. Applegate
said these would all be private streets.
Mr. Beyer asked if parking would be allowed. Mr. Puckett said
they would try to put the driveways in so they could put two
to four cars on each driveway.
Mr. Beyer asked definition of independent and assisted living.
They have 1.2 staff persons per resident, licensed staff available
twenty-four hours a day.
Mr. Beyer asked about the meal service being open to the community.
He asked Mr. Applegate what zoning would be involved with opening
up food service to the community, like it would almost be like
a commercial food service. Mr. Puckett said that was an option.
Mr. Applegate said they would have to take a look at the regulations.
They are allowed to cater meals now and are doing that.
There was a discussion on the steps Union had made to encourage
better quality homes, such as more square feet and two car garages.
Mr. Beyer thought that it would be a step back, to have smaller
square footage and one car garages.
Several of the planning commission members had a problem with
the house size. Mr. Marsh talked about the development that makes
an attractive entrance to the city with lots of green. He said
the initial concept had lots of green, mounding, etc. He said
he had some problems putting the houses so close to the road
and eliminating the wide buffer of green space.
Mr. Puckett said the density requirement is not more than five
units and this proposal is 3.7 units per acre. There is still
a buffer of trees that is already planted.
Mr. Marsh asked about additional water run off. He asked if any
studies have been done.
Mr. Puckett had asked Mr. Landis to do a study and he is doing
a stormwater plan.
Mr. Applegate said they would have Woolpert also look at the
proposed stormwater plan.
In a discussion about two car garages, Mr. Puckett said they did have some
areas of additional parking.
Most of the buildings would be all brick or mostly brick.
Mayor Packard said he would be willing to accept the one car
garage if they can get the zoning to comply.
Mr. Applegate said that people would consider these as apartments
and apartments had always been turned down by the residents,
even when supported by the council. Mr. Applegate said residents
would be afraid that property values would go down.
Mr. Beyer asked that they look into the zoning suitability and
let the planning commission take a new look at the site.
Mr. Marsh asked if this community would generate taxes even though
it was church owned. Mr. Applegate answered that it would and
Mill Ridge would not be exempt.
Mr. Marsh asked if it would generate building permit fees. Mr.
Applegate said only one, two, and three units would have permits
from the city. The four unit buildings would be issued permits
from Montgomery County.
Mr. Beyer said he wanted to consider the one car garages.
Mr. Marsh asked about sidewalks. Sidewalks would be required
along the outer perimeter.
Mr. Beyer asked if privacy fences were allowed. Mr. Puckett said
the back patio areas could be fenced. They could go out eight
to ten feet.
Mr. Puckett said they had decided against putting in curbs which
would allow more natural drainage. Mr. Applegate said he had
no problems with that for private streets.
said he wanted this development to happen but he would not want
the public to file a referendum against the project.
Mr. Beyer clarified that Mill Ridge wanted thirty percent of
the 165 units to be 900 to 1,100 square feet with one car garages.
Mr. Puckett said they would be licensed as residential care.
Mr. Marsh asked if the sketches could include dimensions for
the Mill Ridge proposal.
Mr. Applegate suggested he think about putting the one car garages
on the inside so the appearance is more like a normal width driveway.
said he wanted to go back to the discussion of having a special
meeting. They decided on Wednesday, July 17, at 6:30 p.m.
said Lynnette Ballato would be at the August meeting and the
commission had received copies of the new proposed changes for
Mr. Marsh said the 25 feet sign information is still there. Mr.
Applegate said that they could bring that up at the meeting.
They were unable to find any regulations on industrial park signs.
They will be creating regulations for that.
The city will still not allow signs off site because that would
open the city up to signs all over.
4. Mr. Marsh
moved that the meeting be adjourned. Mr. Beyer seconded the motion.
All concurred and the planning commission meeting was adjourned.
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July 24, 2002
PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING
planning commission meeting was called to order and attendance
was taken. All the planning commission members were present.
REGARDING CONCORD MEADOWS.
From a discussion
at an earlier meeting, the planning commission had forwarded
to the council recommendations on increasing the square footage
for new homes.
Mr. Applegate had met with Sam Knobler and his partner, Les Sandler,
from Mid Life Development, concerning the Concord Meadows Subdivision.
They discussed plans, goals, contracts that are already in place,
such as with Brighten Homes, and how the increased square footage
for homes would affect them.
said Mr. Knobler requested a meeting to discuss the development
since approximately one half of their models would not meet the
owner of Mid Life Development, thanked the commission for having
the special meeting. He said their past relationship had always
been mutually beneficial and that Mid Life had made an investment
Since the completion
of Union Ridge had gone well, Mr. Knobler had decided to go forward
with the Concord Meadows project. He explained that they had
run into a considerable rock problem and had to invest additional
money to do blasting to install the utility lines so the company
had additional expenses on the project in the initial stages.
Mr. Knobler said that he had to establish contracts with builders
to obtain financing. Their assumptions were that they would build
homes for $125,000 to $150,000 range, at 1,400 square feet and
up. They had worked to attract a major builder to the development
and had a contract with Inverness Homes and J. Michael Joly,
which enabled Mid Life Development to obtain financing from the
banks since they had valid contracts with builders.
They also funded widening the road and putting in a turn lane
to State Route 48, to further bring people into the development.
Mr. Knobler passed out information from Brighten Homes, saying
they are probably the second or third largest builder in Dayton.
Mr. Knobler said the development is dependent on having a major
Brighten Homes offer twelve models and they offer basements which
increases the cost. If the square footage requirement would take
place, Brighten Homes would lose six of their models, or fifty
percent of their product line. Mr. Knobler added that based on
a survey that he conducted in Concord Meadows, roughly one third
are under sixteen hundred square feet.
Mr. Knobler said the city had three subdivisions that offer more
expensive homes, Lindeman Commons, Irongate Estates, and Stoneycrest.
To purchase a $130,000 to $150,000 home, the family income would
need to be around $50,000 to $55,000. That is the market that
Mid Life Development is aiming for. If the square footage change
would go through, Mr. Knobler felt he would lose his contract
with Brighten Homes.
Mr. Knobler gave additional figures on the sales for Concord
Meadows. The development was approved in 1999 and started in
2000. They anticipated selling twenty-five to thirty homes a
year. They sold six homes in the last part of 2000, thirteen
homes in 2001, and so far in 2002, they have closed twelve homes.
If they could continue this pace, they will sell twenty to twenty-two
homes this year.
Mr. Knobler said there is not much demand for duplexes now. His
company has increased advertising and they are still struggling
to get new home buyers. He said that taking away half of their
product could put his company at risk for bankruptcy and he needed
Union's help right now. Mr. Knobler said most R-PUD zoning is
stricter zoning and gives the city more control over the developer
in what kind of housing they want. He said he could understand
if they wanted to change the square
footage size in other residential districts. Mr. Knobler
said he felt he
offered a nice product for a certain group of people.
Mr. Beyer said the planning commission could not give Mr. Knobler
anything in writing because the planning commission did not have
that authority. The council could still change the square footage
said that by motion of the planning commission, the city manager
was asked to recommend a proposed zoning code change to the council
which would increase the square footage requirement for new homes.
He suggested that the planning commission again, by motion, instruct
the city manager to take to the council a request to exempt the
R-PUD zoning from the change in the square footage requirement.
Mr. Marsh said
he wanted to make a statement and ask a question before any motions
would be made.
Mr. Marsh said that he felt that Mid Life Development had been
extremely good for the City of Union and he was willing to cooperate
up to a point to keep the development company happy so they could
continue to build in the city. Mr. Marsh asked Mr. Knobler if
he was doing another development in the city and asked if he
would be satisfied with residential zoning with the increased
square footage rather than asking for a re-zoning change to a
R-PUD district. Mr. Knobler said that was correct, he would be
satisfied with the new requirement in residential zoning.
Mr. Marsh moved
that they forward a recommendation to the council for the "R"
designations and "PUD" designations changing the "R"
designations only and exempting
the square footage increase at this point in
time for "PUD". Mr. Beyer seconded the motion. All
concurred and the motion was passed.
to Mr. Marsh's question, the only two R-PUD areas exist in the
city, they are in Union Ridge and Concord Meadows.
said in a few weeks they will be opening up twenty more lots.
He said Inverness had purchased another fourteen lots and Mr.
Joly had purchased seven lots.
1. a. DISCUSSION
OF MILL RIDGE VILLAGE.
Home, at the July 9th planning commission meeting was asking
for 950 square feet single family homes and double units and
single car garages. Mr. Marsh said he would have less trouble
if they were asking that for doubles.
Mr. Beyer said he would be willing to go with smaller square
footage and two car garages.
Mrs. Thomas-Roth said she felt that people did want to downsize
later in life and that they were doing the community a service
by having that as an option. Mr. Shields said he felt they would
need to maintain the two car garage. Mr. Marsh said most people
would only have one car and use the rest of the garage for storage.
Mr. Applegate referred to the Brethren Home representatives saying
that the difference between a one and two car garage was $10,000
and Mr. Applegate said he had checked with a few builders and
that figure was too high, that it was more likely $4,000.00 to
said that people would use the other half of the garage for storage.
Mr. Marsh said he had seen garages that would be considered a
car and a half and they had room for organized storage, with
shelving, and he thought that seemed to be a comfortable living
arrangement for those people.
Mr. Marsh added another consideration could be that at some time
the development might be sold to some other business and could
be sold in individual sections. He said he saw single car garages
with lower square footage as a setback for what the city has
tried to accomplish. Mr. Applegate said that areas that only
have one car garage have cars parked outside and items stored
along side the home.
Mr. Marsh said he felt the problem with the slow development
was with the high monthly maintenance fee of $500.00 per month.
Mr. Applegate said the Brethren Home wants the units sold before
they build. Mr. Applegate had suggested they build homes first
and then they sell them because people want to see what they
Mr. Marsh said he was also concerned about the higher density
compared to their original concept. He thought since Sweet Potato
Ridge is one of the main access roads into the city, he thought
it would make an impression.
Mr. Shields said he would like to continue with a two car garage
but he thought that 1,400 square feet was a large area for one
person to take care of.
Mr. Marsh suggested
single homes with 1,100 square feet and a two car garage. Mr.
Marsh suggested a double at
1,000 and a single at 1,200 square feet. Mr. Beyer said he had
moved from a 1,000 square foot home and a one car garage.
They discussed that the additional square footage cost for a
larger home was not a significant amount, and would mostly be
for the extra building materials.
said they commented about not doing all brick. He suggested that
if they allow the reduced square footage, they would need to
require all brick homes.
For discussion purposes, Mr. Beyer made a list of possible requirements.
Single homes would need 1,200 square feet, two car garages, and
be all brick.
Doubles could be 1,000 square feet, with one car garages in the
There was still some concerns expressed that in the future, the
development would be sold and the units sold individually.
Mr. Applegate said he believed the appearance of the home was
improved with a two car garage. He said where there were one
car garages, there would frequently be four cars in front. With
a two car garage, two cars can go in the garage and more vehicles
can fit in the wider driveway.
The planning commission looked over the minutes from the previous
meeting to see some of the specifics that were presented by the
Mill Ridge Village representatives. Mr. Applegate said the developer
was asking for a minimum of 1,300 square feet for single family
homes so they determined to ask for 1,300 square feet for single
family homes, two car garages, all brick. They will request doubles to
be 1,100 square feet with one car garages, with garages in the
center, and all brick.
Mr. Applegate suggested they ask for additional storage space.
A formal request has not been made so the commission decided
to present this to them at the next planning commission meeting.
There would be a zoning change required and they may need to
create a special zoning for this development. Mr. Applegate said
he did think they would create a new zoning since apartments
are included. Mr. Beyer suggested a non profit PUD or retirement
Mr. Marsh asked about the food service to be offered for the
residents of the city. Mr. Applegate said the developer had called
and changed that. If people are visiting or on the site as a
guest, you could order something but Mill Ridge Village will
not advertise or try to bring someone off the street.
Mr. Beyer asked if they would need to send the proposal to Mill
Ridge Village. Mr. Applegate said he thought they should and
then have them come to the planning commission meeting in August.
They will ask for thirty percent of the units to be single family
3. Mr. Beyer
moved that the meeting be adjourned. Mr. Marsh seconded the motion.
All concurred and the planning commission meeting was adjourned.
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August 13, 2002
Commission meeting was called to order by Mr. Shields and attendance
was taken. Mayor Packard was present during part of the meeting.
1. Mr. Beyer
moved that the minutes of the July 9, 2002 meeting be accepted
as prepared. Mr. Marsh seconded the motion. All concurred and
the minutes were approved.
2. Mr. Beyer then moved to approve the minutes of the July 24,
2002 meeting. Mr. Marsh seconded the motion. All concurred and
the minutes were accepted.
3. 02-13 -
Review of new (revised) proposed conceptual preliminary plan
for Mill Ridge Village site.
Mr. Applegate said they had sent a letter to Mill Ridge Village
on the items that were discussed and determined acceptable from
the special meeting of the planning commission.
said representatives were present from Mill Ridge Village, Scott
Puckett, Tim Hissong, and Barbara Kreuzer.
thanked the planning commission for their time and asked if they
could have further discussion on some of the items.
He said one of the items in the letter was that single family
dwellings would not be less than 1300 square feet. Most of the
single family homes would be from 1400 to 1800 square feet. They
would like to build a few from 1100 to 1200 square feet. Mr.
Puckett said that limiting them to build homes at 1300 square
feet and larger would hamper their ability to serve the people
in Union and they would not be able to fill up the development
at the rate that they wanted.
He also asked
about the all brick requirement. They thought the majority of
the homes would be brick but he asked if they could do some half
brick, with brick up to the window. He said they could still
do a very attractive home and combine it with siding and landscaping.
He said that the development would not be a site for inexpensive
homes. Their organization is one hundred years old and even though
they take deposits for homes, the homes still remain the property
and assets of the Brethren Homes.
asked what the cost would be for a single unit. Mr. Puckett said
they would be in the $75.00 to $80.00 per square foot price range.
The first sixteen units have been more like $90.00 per square
They are trying
to make the buildings more affordable because the units are costing
between $140,000.00 to $160,000.00 and there does not seem to
be a market for that range.
He said they wanted to have different sections with different
sizes of homes.
Mr. Shields asked what percentage of homes would be in the 1100
square foot range.
Mr. Puckett said when the plan was originally developed, 1100
square foot homes were what was planned. Now they are asking
for twenty-five percent to be 900 to 1100 square foot homes.
He said the development was part of Union but it was a specialized
population and deserved special consideration. Otherwise, he
said he felt that many people would drive by and think they could
not afford to live there.
Mr. Marsh asked if any studies had been done on the monthly service
charge. He asked if they had considered modifying the cost as
they add more units.
Mr. Puckett said they had to spread out the cost of providing
ground maintenance, housing manager, security services, and other
services over 125 homes instead of 74 homes, there would be a
savings and the development would be better able to compete with
Mr. Beyer said when he looked at the minutes from the last meeting,
the maintenance costs were $500.00 a month so the people that
would be looking to live in that type of community would not
be poor. Mr. Beyer said he would not want to go that much smaller
with the square footage.
asked that they remain open and check with people of that age
to see what size of home they would prefer.
Mr. Marsh asked if they knew sizes of different areas like Friendship
Village, even though it was a different concept. Mr. Puckett
said the demographics are different depending on the area and
he added that their facility could not be compared to facilities
built with a different concept.
He said they are finding that people that want to come into the
area can not afford it so they buy a cheaper home that will not
be in great shape within fifteen years. Mr. Puckett said that
was the beauty of a continuing care retirement community, that
the property would be maintained. He said that was a wonderful
service for a community.
commented about the tour of the Greenville complex. They saw
the units built in the last phase and he asked if Mr. Puckett
could arrange to show the planning commission the inside of those
newer buildings. The ones that were under construction that the
commission did not see were smaller square footage and also examples
of units with brick up to the window and attractively landscaped.
In response to a question, those buildings have one car garages.
Mr. Puckett said that people are wanting more choices.
Mr. Applegate asked if the planning commission would approve
a reduced square footage, would Mill Ridge stay with two car
Mr. Puckett said the single car garages, if side by side, would
be allowed in doubles. He said the majority of people would want
two car garages.
asked who would pay property taxes. Mr. Puckett said that Mill
Ridge Village would and the monthly fees include the cost of
the property taxes, water usage, and property insurance. Residents
would only insure their own personal possessions. Mr. Puckett
added that retirement communities do more than other communities.
Mr. Applegate suggested they go look at some of the smaller living
units in Greenville.
Ms. Kreuzer talked about some requests from potential buyers
that were close to buying but would need a smaller place that
was more affordable.
The planning commission members wanted Mill Ridge to be more
specific on how many units they actually wanted and where they
would want the 900 square feet units.
Mr. Applegate said they would need a commitment that there would
not be more than a certain percentage of the smaller square footage
Mr. Beyer said they were committed to all brick homes but would
consider dropping some of the square footage.
Mr. Shields said he would like to see an example of a 900 square
foot home and an idea of what the partial brick homes look like.
Mrs. Thomas-Roth said she was interested in seeing an existing
smaller square foot homes at another Brethren Home campus.
Mr. Marsh said he would like to see a map color coded indicating
where the 900 square foot homes would be built.
Mr. Applegate said that if the larger buildings were towards
Sweet Potato Ridge Road and Old Mill Road it would be more to
what the city had approved of in the original concept.
that they would arrange a field trip for the planning commission.
Mr. Puckett said they could send a bus or they could come individually.
The matter was tabled until the planning commission looked at
some of the existing buildings in another development.
of Zoning and Action for the area of the city on the east side
of the Stillwater River.
Property owners Richard Oaks and Tom and Linda Hellard were present.
A map of the existing and proposed zoning was furnished to the
planning commission members.
The city was
working on the comprehensive land use plan and Mr. Applegate
had met with property owners on land annexed on the east side
of the river. There is a requirement in the code that would require
the planning commission to take a look at the zoning. The property
owners would like to start the process of re-zoning. Currently
there are three types of zoning planned for the area: light industrial,
medium density residential (R-4) and low density which would
be R-3. They would also recommend a small area for a commercial
said the property owners were asking for a public hearing to
be set to have the area rezoned.
Mr. Oaks thanked the Halliards for attending the meeting and
said they would like to move the re-zoning along.
Mr. Beyer moved that the planning commission approve this to
go forward to the council to set a public hearing and possible
zoning change. Mrs. Thomas-Roth seconded the motion. All concurred and
the motion was passed.
After a short
break, there was a discussion concerning proposed updates/changes
to the city's sign regulations.
and Mr. Moore were present.
presented the planning commission with her revisions to the sign
regulations as per recommendations from the planning commission
members' last review of the information.
Mr. Beyer questioned
section 1341.05 concerning the enforcement officer. Ms. Ballato
will revise that section to designate the City Manager or his
designee as having enforcement responsibility.
was present for a portion of the planning commission meeting.
Since he had to leave early, he requested Ms. Winemiller to express
that he felt developers should be permitted, within the real
estate section of the regulations, to have small offsite signs
within the right of way to advertise their new residential subdivisions.
He felt this was especially necessary for new subdivisions being
constructed east of the Stillwater River. Mr. Applegate said
he has had several developers also request this type of offsite
directional signage. Mr. Beyer and Mr. Marsh were opposed to
permitting this within the proposed revisions to the sign regulation.
suggested that the Planning Commission take one more opportunity
to review the proposed revisions to the sign regulations.
discussion, Mr. Beyer and Mr. Marsh agreed that they felt the
Planning Commission had reviewed and revised the regulations
to their satisfaction.
Mr. Beyer made
a motion that the planning commission submit to city council
the proposed sign regulation revisions as they were presented
at the August 13, 2002 planning commission meeting and that the
planning commission recommend that city council pass the sign
regulations as an emergency measure.
5. Mr. Beyer
moved to adjourn the planning commission. Mr. Shields seconded
the motion. Mr. Beyer voted against the motion, the other planning
commission members voted for the motion and the meeting was adjourned.
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September 10, 2002
City Staff Members Present:
Commission meeting was called to order by Mrs. Thomas-Roth and
attendance was taken. Mr. Shields was not at the meeting.
1. Mrs. Thomas-Roth
asked if there were any additions or corrections to the minutes
of the August 13, 2002 meeting. There were none so Mr. Packard
moved that the minutes of the August 13 meeting be accepted as
prepared. Mr. Beyer seconded the motion. All concurred and the
minutes were accepted.
2. 02-13 - Review of new proposed conceptual preliminary plan
for Mill Ridge Village site.
welcomed Mr. Musser, Mr. Pucket, and Ms. Kruezer representing
Mill Ridge Village.
A letter requesting approval for a revised preliminary development
plan and containing six items had been
provided to the planning commission members. Mr. Musser offered
to read each item and stop for any comments.
The first item mentioned was a proposal for the construction
of not more than 25% of all independent living units be between
900 and 1100 square feet with garages adjacent to each other
and all units would be duplexes or fourplexes. The duplexes would
have single car garages. Mrs. Thomas-Roth asked if the fourplex
units was were not as popular. Mr. Musser said they would only
have three or four fourplexs. Mrs. Winemiller asked if there
was a garage plan for the existing fourplex in the corner. Mr.
Musser said there was not but one could be built if required.
item was that single family homes would not be built with less
than 1100 square feet.
The third item
stated that the exterior of the home would be brick, stone, or
stone and brick-like composite materials. When asked how high
up the material would go, Mr. Musser said it would go up to the
Mr. Beyer asked
what size of garages would be included for single family homes
and the answer was two car garages.
item was that the Brethren Home planned to build a residential
care facility with services ranging from independent congregate
to assisted living. The Brethren Home would like to reserve the
right to modify the size of the care facility based on market
needs. All this would be licensed residential care with
available twenty-four hours a day. They would plan two floors
on one side and one floor on the other side. If the market was
there, they could put in a two story building.
Mrs. Thomas Roth asked if that would be the largest building
allowed, holding forty to sixty units. Mr. Musser said that would
be the largest they would consider. They would want a facility
large enough to service the campus.
The fifth proposed
item concerned the maintenance building which would be built
along the same theme and would be landscaped. The size would
be roughly thirty feet by fifty feet. There would be an office
space, a place for the storage of mowers, and room to park a
bus and a truck with a snow blade on it. The maintenance area
would be separated by a green space to the north before backing
up to the existing road. The city has green space up to Martindale
was for 125 single family units in all combinations but not including
the residential care facility area.
Mr. Marsh commented that he had a problem with the 900 square
feet and wanted the duplex to be 1100 square feet with the one
car garage. On the single family homes, Mr. Marsh stated that
they have tried throughout the community to increase the value
and sizes of new homes being built and are increasing sizes to
1600 square feet. He said he would like to see 1250 to 1300 square
feet minimum with a two car garage.
He was bothered with the "other quality exterior covering"
as far as the brick or stone exterior but as long as it would look like brick
or stone, he would accept a composite.
Mr. Marsh was not opposed to the residential care facility and
considered that as a strong plus factor. He said he wanted to
hold the square footage higher than what was being requested,
in the event that the Brethren Home would want to sell. In that
event, they would have a property zoned for smaller units than
what would be allowed in other zoning areas.
Mr. Beyer suggested
they call it something like "retirement community zoning"
so if the Brethren Home left, another builder could not come
in and build smaller homes.
said he had no problem with the square footage since this was
for a special situation.
said 1100 square feet was the minimum when they originally approached
Union but Mr. Beyer said that was for two family homes.
Mr. Musser said if they went up to 1250 to 1300 square feet,
they would be eliminating some people that could not afford a
larger home. Mr. Musser said the average units would probably
be 1600 square feet. Mr. Beyer said they were not disputing the
quality or appearance of the proposed homes.
had no problem with the proposal for duplex or single family
said she had no problem with the single family homes. On the
tour in Greenville, they had looked
at 980 square feet and she noted that the units they were proposing
were only 900 square feet.
said generally when potential buyers are presented with a range
of floor plans, they generally do not choose the smallest home,
but go up to a bigger size of home.
Mr. Beyer said
the zoning process would take about three months. Mrs. Winemiller
said they would need some time to prepare the legislation to
come up with the appropriate zoning.
Mr. Musser said they were selling homes in the next phase.
The commission members had no problems with the site plan.
Mr. Beyer suggested they wait until Mr. Shields was present and
then decide at the next meeting. Mrs. Winemiller suggested they
start researching for a zoning change.
Mr. Musser said they will continue to build within the original
Mr. Beyer said they will discuss this at the next workshop meeting
and provide a decision on October 8, 2002.
Mr. Beyer moved
that a work shop meeting be held on Wednesday, October 2, at
7:00 p.m. for a discussion with Oberer Development for a new
development off of Frederick Pike.
3. Mr. Beyer
moved that the meeting be adjourned. Mrs. Thomas-Roth seconded
the motion. All concurred and the planning commission meeting
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